In the next few weeks, my country will become the first to allow the euthanasia of young children with incurable illness. A committee will be formed to decide when "baby euthanasia" is warranted.The clinical director of pediatrics at the University Medical Centre in Groningen, has admitted participating in four "assisted neo-natal terminations." He has drawn up a protocol that has been adopted by the government, saying euthanasia can be considered only in cases with "unbearable suffering," with parental consent and consultation with other doctors.
"If a child is untreatably ill there can be horrendous suffering that makes the last few days or weeks of this child's life unbearable,"
Now the question is: are you going to leave the child like that or are you going to prevent the child from suffering?
20 comments:
Oh Dimitri, what a question for a quiet Sunday morning.
It's different where you live. I support the right to control our own lives, including the ending, as well as doing what is in a suffering infant's best interests. That is, I support it in The Netherlands.
I'm terribly afraid here that without very carefully written law, it will become an excuse. Oregon's law, written for adults, seems to be working well so it may be possible.
Getting much too long for a comment but I worry that hospitals here are already putting financial gain ahead of parents' wishes (Texas is a good example - law signed when Bush was governor). Parents could (and have been) pressured into decisions they were not ready to make.
I support the principle; I'm frightened of its application here.
I am sorry for this question Ann. I am. Thank you for answering on a Sunday morning though..
I am very much troubled by my own thoughts. When rape, I could vote FOR but then again I think we should never terminate human life ourselves.
To be honest, this is out of my league.. But that would be too easy..
It would be somewhat strange to ask for opinions without giving my own. I think my compassion for life prevails.
Thank you for your thoughts Granny..
WA was closer to that example than I. It came to the forefront of the news at the same time as the Terry Schiavo case. She is probably right in that instance and I had read some of the same reports about the family. It seemed to me that Bush was saying one thing in Texas and another in Washington, both for political gain. My reaction may have been a kneejerk reaction against Bush (and a one size fits all law) as much as anything.
Been there done that as has Worried American. I don't talk much about my oldest son who is now 48. He was deprived of oxygen at birth for much too long by well meaning people. The result was severe mental retardation and cerebral palsy. He's been institutionalized since he was too big for me to handle by myself with two other children.
I think his life is happy. He can do simple things. Certainly, it's not as great a tragedy as Worried American's granddaughter and I don't wish for his life to end.
I do wonder about the beginning of his life though and about the decision to keep trying for survival when they knew that severe brain damage would result.
No matter which way we look at it, it's a tragedy for someone. I have a great compassion for life; I also think quality of life can be an important part of any decision and great care needs to be taken that any decision is in the best interests of the child who cannot decide for himself.
That's vague I know but I could have an opinion about one case and turn around and have the opposite opinion about another. In the end, my opinion doesn't matter or shouldn't unless it's my family involved.
We should always be able to talk about subjects like this.
I know I have only been a mom for 3 yrs, but the single most torturous thing for any parent is watching their child suffer. Whether it be w/a high fever and flu or a serious illness, it is simply unbearable. You want to take away all of their pain and suffering and take it on physically yourself. I know BabyGirl is facing surgery in the next few wks, and hopefully all will go well with this, but if she were incurably sick and in pain, my husband and I would do anything... ANYTHING on earth we could do stop her from suffering. A child in pain is something that should be relieved, and if their illness is so severe that the suffering is unbearable and quality of life is nil, then I believe I would support ending that pain.
Wow. What a topic.
My husband and I have discussed the fact that were either of us in a place where there were a choice to "pull the plug", we would want that damned plug pulled. Neither of us wants to suffer, or risk extending our lives in a vegitative state.
But if it were our child, would we go the same route? I'd like to think so. I'd like to think that I'd do whatever it took to prevent my child from suffering unnesessarily. And if that meant humanely ending his or her life, then I'd do it. In a heartbeat.
I can only judge by how I would want things done and if I were suffering terribly, with no hope of getting better, especially if were brain dead, then I would want it ended. Still, I feel so sorry for any parent who would have to make such a choice. I would never want to make that choice for someone else.
I support the right to die with dignity for adults who choose this and I admire the Netherlands for exploring the boundaries beyond that, because I know it's been done with great care and an ethical approach.
Hmmm. I can only imagine how it would feel to be the parent of a child that is in great suffering with no hope of recovery. It would be the toughest thing to face.
As Granny notes, it's worth watching the classism behind any medical policy also - meaning poor people and the disenfranchised are often the ones who do the bulk of suffering and dying in some places (such as executions in the US). I learned recently that there is a great increase in elderly suicide in the US in the past 10 years. Research is pointing to people choosing to die because of the burden of health care costs on their partners or children.
Guess I'm off track now..
I am touched by all of your personal responses my virtual friends. Thank you for sharing. Obviously there again seem to be two sides of the coin here.
Killing death would indeed be a waste of energy I guess Worried. But killing pain is what I read in other comments as well. I am sorry to hear about your grand daughter. I only she could express her feelings..
The lady you described in the examples had the worst of everything happening to her I guess.
It is too sad that politicions many times take advantage of these situations to get media exposure again Granny. Your son had a false start in life Ann. It is must be a blessing to see that he is happy though. Not only for himself but also for parents in general.
Being a parent is the most special thing in my life too Tina. I know exactly what you mean when a child is acheing. I hope the surgery goes well. You know; there are so many skilled doctors out there.
The other day I read something about a guy awakening from a coma after twenty years. Miracles do happen Andie. But there must be something of a personal maximum with everyone..
I agree PT, point is that we, nor doctors oversee the big picture. The bigger picture I mean. We know so little and our ethical standards are just a mere reflection of our humble capacities as human beings..
That must be the most extreme thing to do in your life Lesley. Let's just hope we will be spared of that..
If only we we could see the bigger picture Lorraine..
I couldn't have said that more beautiful WA. Amen.
You're never off track here Gary. That's extremely distubing news about elderly suicides. It makes me feel so tremendously ashamed that billions are spent on arms while our senior citizens aren't able to pay for medicare..
This is tough...have to think about it before commenting...
What a difficult issue this is Dimitri... I don't quite know where I stand ethically on the issue, but faced with such a situation, as a physician, I can pull the plug on someone who's terminally ill and who's dependent on life support to survive. I can also administer high doses of narcotics to alleviate the pain. But I just can't knowingly administer a fatal dose of a medication, as in active euthanasia. I don't know whether it makes ethical or common sense, I just can't do it. But I won't stand in the way of those who can, unless I have a very good reason to do it.
Since decades Euthanasia has already been in practice all over the world illegally. And I strongly disagree and vote against Euthanasia
Are ‘we’ running away from something?
Dimitri and all my virtual friends do make a point to visit this link
http://zoes-place.org.uk/
Yes, I know this is NOT enough and maybe there are lots of ‘strings’ attached.
Yet, it does make a difference…
Hi DA
I have a number of Doctor Friends and their consensus is they all decline active participation in euthanasia.
But where there is suffering in a terminal illness the question can be asked, to what extent we can alleviate that suffering?
Answer
I can administer a drug in sufficient dosage to reduce the suffering from which you may or may not wake up afterwards. I will treat the suffering firstly and the dose to the highest point neceasary to alleviate that suffering which is on the very edge of what is considered a safe dosage.
I expect you to wake up afterwards but I can’t be sure.
So the question can be asked of the patient or his or her next of kin if the patient is unable to respond.
Are You comfortable with me taking that agressive stance on suffering.?
Are You comfortable with the stuation that you may not wake up afterwards ?
Palliative care funding needs to be increased in many countries.
In fact what the Dutch Government is proposing to formalize is what is already happening in many hospital throughout the world.
Wow! It's so hard to know what you would do unless in the shoes of the person making a decision. But what a decision to have to make!
I've always believed abortion is wrong because I don't believe in intefering with nature and think I could probably live with the consequences - even if raped. But I also don't believe I have the right to make that decision for anyone but myself so would never vote to pass a law against abortion. You can't stand in other people's shoes and know how it is for them. And it's also difficult to know how you would react if placed in the same situation unless you have been in it.
I guess I would take a similar stand on Euthenasia. I don't really think we should be taking the lives of others. But the fact that we are able to maintain lives through technology kind of warps the whole argument of "natural life" or "natural death". It's this "unnatural" ability to prolong lives that often extends suffering, too.
I think most people would make the decision to end their child's life out of love rather than fear and they should be allowed to make that decision. Oh, but what a tough one to have to make! My heart breaks thinking about it.
Hey..Interesting topic..I think I would personally support "euthanasia". It's more criminal to let someone bear the brunt. It makes more sense to let go of the misery and pain.
I hadn't heard about this, so thanks for telling us. I guess I agree most with PT in that I support everyone's right to make this choice for himself or herself, but to make the choice for another human being.... I can't think of anything more difficult, especially for a child who cannot speak. We can't know for certain what that child would want. There are no easy answers here.
Not too long ago, doctors believed infants didn't feel pain, so they operated on them without anesthesia. Doctors do not know everything, unfortunately. Even the best ones.
free of religion and all it's binding, i would say... better to end one's suffering than keep them alive by ways of guilt or greed.
the precious little packets. it weighs heavy on the heart, but it is better than to leave them with a lifetime of tribulation, pain or uncertainty. however, care needs to be taken to evaluate the worthiness of the parent's ability to make said decision.
plently more children are brought into theis world to suffer in innumerable ways due to lack of parental foresight, planning or ability. perhaps it is there we should first place emphasis. the story ends not at the crib.
It's a difficult topic you've posted on, Dimitri. A thoughtprovoking one - which is good!
A law like this needs careful consideration. Who is to decide what child dies and what child gets to live? Who can say a miracle isn't going to happen? They CAN happen - even if the child is terminally ill and suffers.
I am personally against taking lives in any form - even to ease suffering. But I also believe I'm not the one to decide for others. How can I make a decision for someone else?
And yet out of compassion I am tempted to agree to such a law.
Many conflicting thoughts here...
I was abroad again, sorry for my belayed reaction friends..
Very difficult Kathleen and Fouad.
What a great link Ammey, "gift of life" Must be very hard but rewarding working there.
I agree Lindsay that it is happening illegally and many doctors are sued for it. That's in fact why it is legalized over here too. To protect doctors..
It is heartbraking Arulba. Decide out of love in stead of fear is a good one.
Thx for visiting Scribblez.
Babies don't feel pain? I wonder how they determined that Julian.
Hi Necolew.
Story doen't end at the crib Monkey, that's where it starts indeed.
We have the same thoughts Amber..
Conflicts of thought needs some serious meditation my Buddhist friend Guro:-)
I wish you all a wonderfull happy weekend!
coooooool man
I support this law in the right circumstances. In my job, the hardest thing for me to do is sign a baby onto hospice, and it does happen. If it were me, and I knew my child would have no quality of life, for instance, if there was severe brain damage, extreme retardation (not Down's Syndrome) or profound birth defects, I could support a doctor giving the baby some gentle anesthesia and letting him/her go quietly. As hard as it would be, I think you have to think of the child's best interest & not your own. If I had one of those issues, I'd want the choice to go.
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